Honour Forums

Discuss the Honour system.

1. sdennan
   Member

   Hi All

   Im looking at planning my next army. I am interested in putting together something based on the Kings German Legion. Any advice on how to put together my own army list for this?

   Simon

   Posted 1 year ago #

2. vilcum
   Member

   You could base your force in a Hundred days inf division
   taking as example 1st King's German Legion Brigade (in clinton 2nd division) at waterloo

   1st King's German Legion Brigade - Colonel G.C.A. du Plat
   1st Line Battalion, KGL - Major W. Robertson - 411
   2nd Line Battalion, KGL - Major G. Muller - 437
   3rd Line Battalion, KGL - Lieutenant-Colonel F. de Wissell - 494
   4th Line Battalion, KGL - Major F. Reb - 416

   You should have to take two english line units, but with the bonus (at least to the eys ;-) ) of one of them being Highlander (2nd Battalion / 73rd (Highland) Regiment)

   You coouls also take your support cavalry from 3rd British (Light) Brigade, including
   1st Light Dragoons, KGL and 2nd Light Dragoons, KGL and throwing one of the Hussard regiment present
   (full OB in http://napoleonic-literature.com/Waterloo_OB/Allied.htm)

   Posted 1 year ago #

3. sdennan
   Member

   1st King's German Legion Brigade (in Clinton’s 2nd division) at Waterloo

   1st King's German Legion Brigade - Colonel G.C.A. du Plat
   1st Line Battalion, KGL - Major W. Robertson
   2nd Line Battalion, KGL - Major G. Muller
   3rd Line Battalion, KGL - Lieutenant-Colonel F. de Wissell
   4th Line Battalion, KGL - Major F. Reb

   3rd Brigade - Maj-Gen. Frederick Adam
   I/52nd Foot (Light) - Lt-Col. Sir Colborne +
   71st Foot (Light)+
   British Foot Battery

   Plus
   II/95th Foot (Rifles) - Mjr. Norcott or Col. Sir Andrew F Barnard
   III/95th Foot (Rifles) incl. Kincaid

   Organic
   3rd Hannoverian Brigade - Col. Hew Halkett (
   Landwehr Btn. "Bremenvorde" - Lt-Col. Schulenberg
   Landwehr Btn. "Salzgitter" - Mjr. von Hammerstein -
   Landwehr Btn. "Osnabruck"
   Landwehr Btn. "Quackenbruck" - Mjr. Baron von dem Hunefeldt

   Reserve
   3rd British (Light) Brigade
   1st Light Dragoons, KGL
   2nd Light Dragoons, KGL
   23rd Light Dragoon and throwing one of the Hussard regiment present
   KGL Horse Battery

   Posted 1 year ago #

4. vilcum
   Member

   You are using large (+) units, according tha AB that are only used in building a peninsular division, It could seem more apropiate (as it is a waterloo div) build it around a Hundred days div.
   6 Infantry
   1 RA BTY
   2 Infantry

   But the real OB traslates so much better to the peninsular list that I would use it almost as you have put them, as a peninsular Inf Div.

   1st King's German Legion Brigade - Colonel G.C.A. du Plat , Subcommander
   1st Line Battalion, KGL
   2nd Line Battalion, KGL
   3rd Line Battalion, KGL
   4th Line Battalion, KGL

   3rd Brigade - Maj-Gen. Frederick Adam, extra Subcommander when attacking.
   71st Foot (Light) + (fielded as elite, Valiant/Experienced/SK3)

   When attacking I would represent the two extra inf units as the
   1st Battalion / 52nd (Oxfordshire) Light Infantry splited in two normal units(allowed by their big numbers)

   British Foot Battery : Captain Samuel Bolton's Battery, RFA - 217, (5) 9lb guns, (1) 5.5 inch howitzer

   Plus
   two skirmishers bases from II/95th Foot (Rifles)

   Organic
   3rd Hannoverian Brigade - Col. Hew Halkett (
   Landwehr Btn. "Bremenvorde" - Lt-Col. Schulenberg
   Landwehr Btn. "Salzgitter" - Mjr. von Hammerstein -
   Landwehr Btn. "Osnabruck"
   Landwehr Btn. "Quackenbruck" - Mjr. Baron von dem Hunefeldt

   Reserve
   3rd British (Light) Brigade
   1st Light Dragoons, KGL
   2nd Light Dragoons, KGL
   23rd Light Dragoon
   2nd Hussars, KGL - Lieutenant-Colonel Linsingen - 564
   KGL Horse Battery : Major Augustus Sympher's Battery, KGLH - 225,(5) 9lb guns, (1) 5.5 inch howitzer

   Posted 1 year ago #

5. John de Terre Neuve
   Member

   Hi,

   I have wanted to build an Hanoverian Organic Bde for Lasalle for some time, using Perry figures. Does anyone have any suggestions for a combined Feldbattalion/landwehr bde and would you add any artillery to the bde. I was thinking of doing the 4th Hanoverian Bde in the 6th Corps at Waterloo. Here is the OB, I believe Bruckman's Artillery Battery is indeed Hanoverian.

   I am also interested on how I should rate this organic bde.

   Thanks for any suggestions.

   John

   6th Division - Lieutenant-General Sir Galbraith Lowry Cole - 5,149

   10th British Brigade - Major-General Sir John Lambert K.C.B.
   Aide-de-Camp
   Lieutenant T. Baynes - 39th Foot
   Major of Brigade
   Major H.G. Smith - 95th Rifles
   1st Battalion / 4th (King's Own) Regiment - Lieutenant-Colonel Francis Brooke - 669
   1st Battalion / 27th (Inniskilling) Regiment - Captain John Hare - 698
   1st Battalion / 40th (2nd Somersetshire) Regiment - Major Arthur R. Heyland - 761
   2nd Battalion / 81st (Loyals) Infantry Regiment - 439

   4th Hanoverian Brigade - Colonel Best
   Lüneberg Landwehr Battalion - Lieutenant-Colonel de Ramdohr - 624
   Verden Landwehr Battalion - Major de Decken - 621
   Osterode Landwehr Battalion - Major Baron Reden - 677
   Münden Landwehr Battalion - Major de Schmidt - 660

   Artillery - Lieutenant-Colonel Brückmann - 659
   Major George Unett's Battery, RFA - 264, (5) 9lb guns, (1) 5.5 inch howitzer
   Captain James Sinclair's Battery, RFA - 395, (5) 9lb guns, (1) 5.5 inch howitzer

   Posted 1 year ago #

6. Biggreenbugeyedmonster
   Member

   Hi John,
   How Id rate 6th Division at Waterloo:
   1/4th (King's), 1/27th (Enniskilling) (aka "the skins") and 1/40th Foot were crack first battalions that had originally part of the select 1805 BEF - they were the epitome of what Wellington termed "my old Spanish infantry". For example, 1/40th, were largely Irishmen who had formed one of the original battalions in the picked expeditionary force formed in 1805. They fought at Vimiero, Talavera, Bussaco, Salamanca (where they played a key role), Vittoria, Sorauren, Nivelle, Orthez, Toulouse... I'd rate these three battalions as Valiant/Experienced.
   On the other hand, 2/81st was an inexperienced second battalion. I'd rate them as Reliable/Amateur.
   The Hanoverian Landwehr were very young recruits with very little training. I'd rate them as Unpredictable/Amateur.

   Incidentally Vilcum - the 2/73rd Foot was a relatively inexperienced second battalion (with other second battalions in Halkett's brigade whose experience was limited to the unfortunate Bergen-op-Zoom escapade). I doubt they would rate as 'elite' (or even as veteran).

   Posted 1 year ago #

7. John de Terre Neuve
   Member

   Thanks BGBEM,

   I sort of screwed up my question though by posting the wrong bde. I meant the 1st Hanoverian Bde, which had no landwehr, but contained feldbattalion and light battalion. Any rating suggestions for these chaps including the feldjagers.

   Sorry about the error,

   John

   1st Hanoverian Brigade - Major-General Count Kielmansegge
   Bremen Field Battalion - Lieutenant-Colonel Langrehr - 573
   Verden Field Battalion - Major de Senkopp - 573
   Duke of York's First Field Battalion - Major Baron Bulow - 573
   Lüneburg Light Battalion - Lieutenant-Colonel Kleucke
   Grubenhagen Light Battalion - Lieutenant-Colonel Wurmb
   2 Comapnies of the Field-Jäger Battalion - Captain von Reden

   Posted 1 year ago #

8. vilcum
   Member

   @Biggreenbugeyedmonster
   You are right, rating the 2/73rd Foot as elite is not historical acurate, indeed they were not with clinton... if you have a look to my second post you will discover that the elite big unit is the the 1/71st Foot, a veteran unit and with a size (810) that justifies making it "big" . I mistakenly confused the scots in my first post. Anyway the real point to class them as elite is the need to include one (and only one) elite unit in the "Peninsular inf division" to be an AB-compatible (for competition purposes)army list, I choose the 1/72 over the 1/52 only because the scots miniatures will mark them as different to other line at first glance.

   Posted 1 year ago #

9. Biggreenbugeyedmonster
   Member

   Hi John,

   lst Hanoverian Brigade (von Kielmansegge) were young troops in their first battle. On the other hand, they were volunteers, and had a cadre of KGL veterans to stiffen them. So I'd rate them as Reliable/Experienced. The Jager I'd rate as two SK bases. The Hanoverians used British drill and tactics, so should be limited to linear tactics.

   Also in von Alten's division there was 5th British Brigade (Halkett), which consisted of four young "second" battalions (or "new regiments" to quote Wellington). I'd rate these four battalions as Reliable/Amateur.

   And the 2nd KGL Brigade (von Ompteda) - one of the best brigades in Wellington's army. The two KGL Light Battalions, especially, were arguably the cream of Wellington's army. The 5th KGL Line was a veteran formation, but the 8th Line's experience was more limited. I'd rate the two KGL Light bttalions as Valiant/Experienced SK3, the 5th KGL Line as Valiant/Experienced, and the 8th KGL Line as Reliable/Experienced.

   Vilcum - I totally agree with you rating the 1/71st as an 'elite' unit. Another one of those "well founded" 1805 BEF battalions, the 71st were in the Peninsula from the start with Wellesley. A bunch of very hard Glaswegian veterans (think a unit composed of 800 Begbies!).

   Posted 1 year ago #

10. John de Terre Neuve
    Member

    Thanks BGBEM, I will have to get painting.

    John

    Posted 1 year ago #

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